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Disable round end pacifism and add a new command to pacify everyone #273

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About the PR

I have removed the automatic forced pacifism when the round ends.
I also added a new command that forces everyone to be pacified.

Why / Balance

I believe automatic forced pacifism is just not a good idea for the following reasons:

  • Firstly, it does not succeed at all at stopping EORG, there are many ways of doing EORG that are simply still possible, even with forced pacifism, such as using thieving gloves or breaking structures.
  • Secondly, I believe it stops actual RP from happening and just makes the end of round feel even more disconnected from the rest of the round. There are many situations where players might still have a very good reason to be fighting at CC. This breaks RP enough for me that I would honestly prefer someone trying to EORG every round over forced pacifism.

The command was added for admins to be able to use when the EORG goes completely out of hand and security is unable to stop it from affecting too many people. The command does exactly the same thing as what forced pacifism did before

Technical details

Moved the forced pacifism code from an end of round system to a new command.
None of the actual pacifism code was changed.

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Requirements

Breaking changes

Changelog

🆑

  • remove: Removed automatic forced pacifism at the end of round.
    ADMIN:
  • add: Added a new command to permanently force everyone on the server to be pacified, This is intended to be used if EORG gets too out of hand.

@github-actions github-actions bot added the S: Needs Review Review is requested label Jan 4, 2025
@youtissoum youtissoum changed the title Disable round end pacifism and add new a command to pacify everyone Disable round end pacifism and add a new command to pacify everyone Jan 4, 2025
@NakataRin
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I like this change. +1

@SteroidsOnSteroids
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The issue is most glaring obvious during zombie rounds, where the ERT on CC can't shoot the zombies and the ravenous, mindless, bloodthirsty zombies that normally WOULD be attacking without a second thought simply cannot.

That said, I agree with this change.

@Zap527
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Zap527 commented Jan 4, 2025

So, a bit of transparency as to why we haven't disabled this yet.

When adminning, it used to be a HUGE pain to quell EORG. The thing is that something that seems simple often times escalates into something which isn't, and at that point, there isn't a culprit. People act in self defense, and we never wanted to punish people for doing so, but also them doing that caused us more headache. It takes a lot of time to read through logs (and I'd often miss and also force the person I was ahelping to miss the start of the next round because of log diving)

The admin team is aware that this isn't a perfect solution and that it sucks. I actually pushed against EORG prevention at first and this is why we initially had a popup. But we quickly saw that people just do NOT read the rules, at all. And it wasn't people being ill-intended, just people forgetting or not being thorough enough. We don't want to start banning people left and right because of something the game mechanically lets you do. Not only is it shitty for the player, it's a lot of admin work and it's bad rep. No one likes being banned, period, for things which they don't think are big deals.

Before EORG, we had probably 1/3 or 1/4 rounds which ended with some sort of EORG. Mostly coming from syndicates which stopped caring after the round "ended" and bought explosives or as a continuation of evac shenanigans. And security would then pull lethals and none of it was reasonable while 3 people laid on the ground crit at centcomm.

We already had (and still do have) a command which pacifies everyone. It isn't hard to do. The thing is, once EORG gets out of hand, it's already too late. We can't "UN-EORG" centcomm. And it often times just feels awful for people being wronged and then being prevented from attacking while others can.

Don't think the admins don't know about this and don't care, because we do. But every solution I've workshopped so far ended up being shut down for failing to adress why we had EORG prevention in the first place or causing more problems than it solved.

Ideally, a solution to EORG:

  • Mechancially prevents players from committing harmful acts for no reason. All of the harmful acts.
  • Does not quell ongoing conlfict without inciting third parties from jumping in

It's really hard to find a balance between these two.

@SteroidsOnSteroids
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SteroidsOnSteroids commented Jan 4, 2025

Ideally, a solution to EORG:

Mechancially prevents players from committing harmful acts for no reason. All of the harmful acts.
Does not quell ongoing conlfict without inciting third parties from jumping in

What if only specific roles were pacified in certain ways during certain rounds? For example, no one would be pacified at CC on zombie rounds. On syndicate rounds, sec and ERT would be not pacified (if a syndicate was engaging in combat on the shuttle recently, perhaps it's possible to prevent that specific syndicate from being pacified in order to prevent that fight from becoming one-sided). On survivor rounds everyone could be pacified.

I'd argue it's a game of picking and choosing who to pacify, and when.

@Zap527
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Zap527 commented Jan 4, 2025

That isn't very future-proofed, and also wouldn't work with midrounds. I think a good bandaid (which wouldnt fix the core issue but might help alleviate it) would be to prevent antag gamerules from being picked once evac is called, so you don't end up with situations where zombies turn on the shuttle.

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Code is good. Leaving up for admin discussion

@FluffMe FluffMe added S: Awaiting Admin Input Discussion by the admin team is required S: Approved by Maintainer and removed S: Needs Review Review is requested labels Jan 6, 2025
@Lyndomen
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Lyndomen commented Jan 7, 2025

Delta anecdote here, we updated our Central Command layout to break up the crowds of people a bit. We have a larger CC rework in progress to revamp the whole thing, but found that this was a nice natural decrease to EORG without any code or admin intervention required.

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6 participants