Questions about the Excel download button on the TaxBrain results page

[martinholmer]

Has anyone used the Excel download capability successfully?
Whatever is downloaded will not import into the OpenOffice spreadsheet.
I don't have Excel on my computer, does everything work smoothly when you do have Excel?

I'm curious, why this option is available in an open-source project.
What capability is the Excel download providing that the CSV download is not providing?

@MattHJensen @hdoupe @GoFroggyRun

[GoFroggyRun]

@martinholmer asked:

Has anyone used the Excel download capability successfully?
Whatever is downloaded will not import into the OpenOffice spreadsheet.
I don't have Excel on my computer, does everything work smoothly when you do have Excel?

Yes. After #675, the Excel should work smoothly, and exactly the same as CSV table. Here's an overview of possible downloads (upon #675 ):

COMBINED PAYROLL AND INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX: DIFFERENCE BETWEEN   BASE AND USER PLANS BY EXPANDED INCOME BIN (2017)
--
  | Tax Units with Tax Cut | Tax Units with Tax Increase | Count | Average Tax Change | Total Tax Difference | Percent with Tax Increase | Percent with Tax Decrease | Share of Overall Change
  | Thousands | Thousands | Thousands |   | Billions |   |   |   |  
Less than 10 | 17,423 | 0 | 23,170 | -7 | -0.2 | 0.0 | 75.2 | 1.2 |  
10-20 | 16,263 | 0 | 24,458 | -18 | -0.4 | 0.0 | 66.5 | 3.2 |  
20-30 | 13,070 | 0 | 19,064 | -29 | -0.6 | 0.0 | 68.6 | 4.1 |  
30-40 | 11,659 | 0 | 16,252 | -42 | -0.7 | 0.0 | 71.7 | 5 |  
40-50 | 10,082 | 0 | 13,300 | -57 | -0.8 | 0.0 | 75.8 | 5.6 |  
50-75 | 17,910 | 0 | 22,762 | -78 | -1.8 | 0.0 | 78.7 | 13.1 |  
75-100 | 11,494 | 0 | 13,551 | -116 | -1.6 | 0.0 | 84.8 | 11.6 |  
100-200 | 21,209 | 0 | 23,009 | -202 | -4.6 | 0.0 | 92.2 | 34.5 |  
200-500 | 7,453 | 0 | 7,911 | -303 | -2.4 | 0.0 | 94.2 | 17.8 |  
500-1000 | 1,061 | 0 | 1,178 | -294 | -0.3 | 0.0 | 90 | 2.6 |  
1000+ | 536 | 0 | 635 | -245 | -0.2 | 0.0 | 84.4 | 1.2 |  
All | 128,713 | 0 | 170,055 | 0 | -13.5 | 0 | 0 | 100 |  
Source:   http://127.0.0.1:8000/taxbrain/43/ |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |  

TOTAL LIABILITIES BY CALENDAR YEAR (CHANGE) |   |   |   |   |   |   |  
-- | -- | -- | -- | -- | -- | -- | --
  | 2017 | 2018 | 2019 | 2020 | 2021 | 2022 | 2023 | 2024 | 2025 | 2026 | Total
  | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions
Individual Income Tax Liability Change | 0.0 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.1 | 0.6
Payroll Tax Liability Change | -13.5 | -14.1 | -14.6 | -15.2 | -15.7 | -16.3 | -17 | -17.7 | -18.4 | -19.1 | -161.6
Combined Payroll and Individual Income   Tax Liability Change | -13.5 | -14.1 | -14.6 | -15.1 | -15.7 | -16.3 | -16.9 | -17.6 | -18.3 | -19 | -161
Source:   http://127.0.0.1:8000/taxbrain/43/ |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |  

and

BASE PLAN TAX VARS, WEIGHTED TOTAL BY EXPANDED INCOME BIN (2017) |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |  
-- | -- | -- | -- | -- | -- | -- | -- | --
  | Returns | AGI | Standard Deduction Filers | Standard Deduction | Itemizers | Itemized Deduction | Personal Exemption | Taxable Income | AMT | Individual Income Tax Liabilities | Payroll Tax Liablities | Combined Payroll and Individual   Income Tax Liabilities
  | Thousands | Billions | Thousands | Billions | Thousands | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions | Billions |   |   |  
Less than 10 | 23,157 | 89.6 | 21,147 | 145.9 | 21 | 0.1 | 92.8 | 3.3 | 0.0 | -8.2 | 12.3 | 4.1 |   |   |  
10-20 | 24,467 | 237.4 | 19,341 | 189 | 397 | 4.5 | 154.5 | 35.7 | 0.0 | -33.6 | 33.5 | -0.1 |   |   |  
20-30 | 18,943 | 321.4 | 16,568 | 152.7 | 929 | 13.2 | 131.7 | 96.9 | 0.1 | -16.6 | 42.4 | 25.8 |   |   |  
30-40 | 16,372 | 423.7 | 14,106 | 132.8 | 1,834 | 27.7 | 120 | 183.5 | 0.0 | 2.7 | 52.9 | 55.6 |   |   |  
40-50 | 13,283 | 484.3 | 10,748 | 103.3 | 2,465 | 39.5 | 98.1 | 261.8 | 0.0 | 22.2 | 58 | 80.3 |   |   |  
50-75 | 22,758 | 1,216.4 | 15,426 | 160.8 | 7,299 | 133.3 | 179.9 | 752.8 | 0.1 | 88.8 | 136.1 | 224.9 |   |   |  
75-100 | 13,548 | 1,070.8 | 7,137 | 80.5 | 6,406 | 129.1 | 118.6 | 743.8 | 0.1 | 102 | 120.7 | 222.7 |   |   |  
100-200 | 23,024 | 2,964.9 | 6,621 | 80.7 | 16,399 | 413.4 | 243.9 | 2,228.5 | 1.6 | 367 | 359.9 | 726.9 |   |   |  
200-500 | 7,922 | 2,148.3 | 648 | 7.9 | 7,270 | 305.6 | 80.5 | 1,755.4 | 21.5 | 409.2 | 200.7 | 609.9 |   |   |  
500-1000 | 1,179 | 772 | 101 | 1.2 | 1,076 | 81.1 | 0.1 | 691.3 | 7.9 | 202.5 | 38.1 | 240.6 |   |   |  
1000+ | 636 | 1,867.9 | 88 | 1.1 | 544 | 121.9 | 0.0 | 1,748.9 | 14.3 | 564.7 | 32.9 | 597.6 |   |   |  
All | 170,055 | 11,445.6 | 111,948 | 1,091.8 | 44,641 | 1,269.7 | 1,248.8 | 8,502.5 | 45.7 | 1,700.2 | 1,089.9 | 2,790.1 |   |   |  
Source:   http://127.0.0.1:8000/taxbrain/43/ |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |  

@martinholmer also asked:

I'm curious, why this option is available in an open-source project.
What capability is the Excel download providing that the CSV download is not providing?

I'm not an experienced Excel user myself. Other Excel users suggested that:

XLS is an MS Excel workbook binary file, which holds information about all the worksheets in a workbook, comprising both content and formatting (number masking, colouring, conditional formatting, etc), and can also hold additionals like charts, images, etc. XLS files can only be read by applications that have been especially written to read their format, and can only be written in the same way.

So it seems to me that Excel files are more ready-for-manipulation than CSV files, given MS Excel is available.

[martinholmer]

@GoFroggyRun said in issue #678:

After #675, the Excel [button] should work smoothly, and exactly the same as CSV [button].

Thanks for your work on making these download buttons work better.

But I'm still wondering what the Excel button provides that the CSV button does not provide.
Exactly the same information gets downloaded. And the downloaded CSV file can easily be read by Excel or any other spreadsheet program. So, why have two buttons when we could have just one CSV button? One button means less development and maintenance work without any loss in the utility of TaxBrain.

My point is about the downloaded file's format, not about the merits of different spreadsheets.

What other people told you about Excel and Excel files is very out-of-date and/or irrelevant to my view that we should eliminate the Excel button. Here is what others told you:

XLS is an MS Excel workbook binary file, which holds information about all the worksheets in a workbook, comprising both content and formatting (number masking, colouring, conditional formatting, etc), and can also hold additional [objects] like charts, images, etc. XLS files can only be read by applications that have been especially written to read their format, and can only be written in the same way.

First, what TaxBrain downloads and modern versions of Excel read and write is not a binary .xls file.
Rather what is downloaded is an XML text file with a .xlsx extension. Excel switched to the file format about ten years ago as described at this page.

My point is that once the data content (from a downloaded CSV file) is imported into any spreadsheet, then the user can enhance that spreadsheet anyway they want and save it in the spreadsheet's native file format.

Why don't we remove the Excel buttons?
Nobody has been able to say what they add given that we already have a CSV button.

@MattHJensen @hdoupe

[MattHJensen]

I agree that there is no reason to have an excel download option. If we were making use of linked spreadsheets, there might be value, but we're not, so a csv is perfectly adequate.

[hdoupe]

@MattHJensen said:

I agree that there is no reason to have an excel download option. If we were making use of linked spreadsheets, there might be value, but we're not, so a csv is perfectly adequate.

I agree. Since we are not actually using Excel capabilities, there is no need for an Excel option.