Personas-and-Pathways.srt

1
00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:03,180
Anelda van der Walt: I'm Anelda van der Walt
. I'm a South African,

2
00:00:03,210 --> 00:00:08,370
the living in South Africa all
my life, many generations now, I

3
00:00:08,370 --> 00:00:11,580
live in a small coastal village,
there's a photo of what you can

4
00:00:11,580 --> 00:00:13,860
see when you climb the hill just
behind my house.

5
00:00:15,420 --> 00:00:20,910
And I work with universities
across South Africa, in Africa

6
00:00:20,910 --> 00:00:25,140
and an outside of Africa, to
help researchers adopt

7
00:00:25,170 --> 00:00:31,950
technology in their research.
What I'm going to talk to you

8
00:00:31,950 --> 00:00:36,240
about today, as we said, was
personas and pathways, which are

9
00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:40,440
two design elements that have
different benefits in your

10
00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:44,700
project. It doesn't only help
you to think about designing the

11
00:00:44,700 --> 00:00:48,300
right project, but it also helps
you to communicate within the

12
00:00:48,300 --> 00:00:51,900
project and to your stakeholders
about design decisions that

13
00:00:51,900 --> 00:00:56,070
you've made. And of course, it
helps you to attract the right

14
00:00:56,070 --> 00:01:03,330
users, and contributors and help
them to stay in your project. So

15
00:01:03,390 --> 00:01:07,140
for many of you are doing very
different projects, before this

16
00:01:07,140 --> 00:01:09,960
talk, I was accurately looked at
the list of projects. Again,

17
00:01:09,960 --> 00:01:13,260
it's so diverse. And some of you
might be thinking, well,

18
00:01:13,290 --> 00:01:16,350
personas and pathways aren't
really relevant to my project.

19
00:01:16,350 --> 00:01:20,220
But regardless of what kind of
project you're doing in open

20
00:01:20,220 --> 00:01:25,110
science, personas and pathways
can really help you a lot. So I

21
00:01:25,110 --> 00:01:28,470
hope by the end of this project,
you'll see at the end of this

22
00:01:28,470 --> 00:01:33,510
talk, you'll see a few ways in
which you can use it. So you

23
00:01:33,510 --> 00:01:38,700
will need personas and pathways
if you want users and all

24
00:01:38,700 --> 00:01:42,450
contributors. And for all the
projects that is in the OLS

25
00:01:42,450 --> 00:01:47,880
Definitely, this is what
we want, right. Just very

26
00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:52,890
quickly, what are personas. And
very recently, I was going

27
00:01:52,890 --> 00:01:57,060
through the process of creating
personas for a project. And I

28
00:01:57,060 --> 00:02:02,880
was looking at various personas
online various resources. And I

29
00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:08,100
was stunned to see how many
personas seem to be created to

30
00:02:08,100 --> 00:02:16,650
tick boxes to, to really, really
just not necessarily speaking to

31
00:02:16,650 --> 00:02:20,610
the people that might be coming
to their projects. According to

32
00:02:20,610 --> 00:02:23,760
Mozilla beside as an imaginary
user based on real world

33
00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:27,870
observations and understandings
of actual potential current

34
00:02:27,870 --> 00:02:32,580
users, and in our case, also
contributors. But what's really

35
00:02:32,580 --> 00:02:36,000
important is that you have to
know your audience, you have to

36
00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:39,900
know the people that you're
working with, to be able to

37
00:02:39,900 --> 00:02:43,770
create an accurate persona. And
that's where the data comes in.

38
00:02:43,770 --> 00:02:48,060
I think most of us in the school
definitely in the life projects

39
00:02:48,090 --> 00:02:54,540
are aware of the importance of
data to inform decisions. And so

40
00:02:54,540 --> 00:02:58,500
maybe at the beginning of your
project, you may not really know

41
00:02:58,530 --> 00:03:02,820
your users or your contributors.
And we'll, we'll speak a little

42
00:03:02,820 --> 00:03:05,850
bit more about that later. So
your your personas might not be

43
00:03:05,850 --> 00:03:11,340
that accurate. But as you go
along, you can improve those

44
00:03:11,340 --> 00:03:14,250
personas as you get to know your
users better. And as your

45
00:03:14,910 --> 00:03:21,090
project grows in terms of
diversity and voices. pathways

46
00:03:21,150 --> 00:03:30,240
are ways for people to stay
involved in your project. So you

47
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:36,630
may you may have people coming
in as developers, you may have

48
00:03:36,630 --> 00:03:42,090
people coming in as users, and
what are the what are the things

49
00:03:42,090 --> 00:03:45,180
that will make them come into
your project and stay involved.

50
00:03:45,930 --> 00:03:49,710
So not every project that can
lead not every person that comes

51
00:03:49,710 --> 00:03:52,770
into your project will
necessarily take on a leadership

52
00:03:52,770 --> 00:03:57,750
role in the future? But how can
you help people to see how they

53
00:03:57,750 --> 00:04:00,900
can be involved regardless of
what they what they resource or

54
00:04:00,900 --> 00:04:04,440
skill level, or motivations are.
And we'll talk a little bit more

55
00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:08,430
about that later on. For me, a
pathway is less about the

56
00:04:08,430 --> 00:04:11,310
picture on the left, where there
is this golden highway that

57
00:04:11,310 --> 00:04:15,690
takes you to where the sun
shines behind the mountain. And

58
00:04:15,690 --> 00:04:20,910
it's more about something like a
treasure map where someone might

59
00:04:20,910 --> 00:04:24,600
look at the map and say, Oh, I
want to go you know, have a look

60
00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:27,960
at the river. And then someone
else might say I'm really fond

61
00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,960
of forests. And someone else
might say well, I'm going to

62
00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:34,380
take the little boat that's out
there and go across the ocean to

63
00:04:34,380 --> 00:04:38,280
the other side of the peninsula.
So there are many different ways

64
00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:43,890
that people can can be involved
and there's no expectation of a

65
00:04:43,890 --> 00:04:49,050
leadership progression. Why are
personas and pathways

66
00:04:49,050 --> 00:04:53,040
important and the way that I see
it is personas will bring the

67
00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:57,000
right people to your project and
pathways will help them to stay

68
00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:03,720
there. Just getting back to when
he developed them, it's optimal

69
00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,480
to develop them at the beginning
of your project, it might save

70
00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:09,810
you a lot of time if you are

71
00:05:10,020 --> 00:05:13,290
thinking about who you are
developing this project for from

72
00:05:13,290 --> 00:05:18,450
the beginning, and also what you
want them to do there. And

73
00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:23,310
thinking about your project in
terms of how it will grow, you

74
00:05:23,310 --> 00:05:27,390
will need as the project go
grow, and what you can offer

75
00:05:27,390 --> 00:05:31,620
your users and your
contributors. So typically, you

76
00:05:31,620 --> 00:05:34,950
can develop personas and
pathways beginning. And then of

77
00:05:34,950 --> 00:05:38,460
course, as I mentioned before,
use the data that you gather as

78
00:05:38,460 --> 00:05:42,420
the project grows, as new voices
join your project to improve

79
00:05:42,420 --> 00:05:49,410
those. The next slide is just an
image of the design thinking

80
00:05:49,410 --> 00:05:52,770
process. And I really like this
one, I think there's a lot of

81
00:05:52,770 --> 00:05:55,380
questions here that might be
useful to your projects beyond

82
00:05:55,380 --> 00:06:00,150
just thinking about pathways and
personas. And and what I want to

83
00:06:00,150 --> 00:06:05,340
show you is that projects, I
sometimes get the feeling that

84
00:06:05,370 --> 00:06:10,260
in open science, every project
will just work like it has to

85
00:06:10,260 --> 00:06:14,250
work, right because we invest so
much time and effort and emotion

86
00:06:14,250 --> 00:06:19,830
into it. But the realities, and
sometimes projects, when you

87
00:06:19,830 --> 00:06:23,790
can't get past the prototype
stage, you have to sit back and

88
00:06:23,790 --> 00:06:27,150
really think about whether this
is the thing that was going to

89
00:06:27,150 --> 00:06:30,000
be you know, do solve the
problem that you set out to

90
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:33,180
solve. And just going back to
the drawing board and looking

91
00:06:33,180 --> 00:06:36,180
again, at your users looking
again, at your, at your

92
00:06:36,180 --> 00:06:39,210
contributors, who did you think
you were going to attract? Who

93
00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:42,690
are you really attracting, and
how you can edit that? I really,

94
00:06:43,380 --> 00:06:46,530
I really like this one, I think
I'm going to be using this just

95
00:06:46,530 --> 00:06:49,800
in thinking about our own
projects as well. The personas

96
00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:53,520
typically fit into After
gathering the data through your

97
00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:58,830
exploration and emphasizing in
the stage where you are defining

98
00:06:59,220 --> 00:07:02,880
what specific needs are that a
person has that is coming to

99
00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:07,920
your project. One of the things
that we've used in one of our

100
00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:12,510
Afrimap project is
to think about who our

101
00:07:12,540 --> 00:07:19,230
users and contributors could be
our mind map showing all the

102
00:07:19,230 --> 00:07:24,720
roles that they are in a
project. And the reason why I'm

103
00:07:24,780 --> 00:07:29,340
showing you this mind map is
because as you Google for

104
00:07:29,340 --> 00:07:32,460
information about developing
personas, you might come across

105
00:07:32,490 --> 00:07:38,160
a lot of references, that speaks
about developing personas, from

106
00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:42,690
a company's point of point of
view, to attract users and to

107
00:07:42,690 --> 00:07:50,970
get the rights, the rights
elements into a platform or a

108
00:07:50,970 --> 00:07:55,770
software or a project for the
users. So really mostly about

109
00:07:55,770 --> 00:08:00,270
users. But in open science
projects, and very specifically

110
00:08:00,270 --> 00:08:04,500
in open community communities
and software development, we

111
00:08:04,500 --> 00:08:07,800
have not only have to think
about our customer, the person

112
00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:11,310
that will be using our tool or
our platform, or will be joining

113
00:08:11,310 --> 00:08:14,130
the community as a community
member. But we also have to

114
00:08:14,130 --> 00:08:17,670
think about personas and
pathways for people who are

115
00:08:17,670 --> 00:08:20,520
developing, I apologize for my
dog barking in the background.

116
00:08:21,780 --> 00:08:26,700
We have to think about our
contributors, our community

117
00:08:26,730 --> 00:08:37,530
developers and other roles, not
only the users. So this kind of

118
00:08:37,560 --> 00:08:43,470
mind map has helped me a lot to
think about personas from a user

119
00:08:43,470 --> 00:08:48,600
point of view, from the learners
point of view. And then also how

120
00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:52,380
can we attract developers and
what what are we giving to them?

121
00:08:52,410 --> 00:08:57,510
How are we motivating them to
join the project and what what

122
00:08:57,510 --> 00:08:57,840
we vote

123
00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:01,680
on are getting here and how they
are they can use being involved

124
00:09:01,680 --> 00:09:05,040
in our project to grow their own
skills and equities as well.

125
00:09:08,490 --> 00:09:11,820
Another tool that I've used in a
different project is the

126
00:09:11,820 --> 00:09:13,020
escalator project.

127
00:09:14,580 --> 00:09:20,340
Here we used existing monitoring
and evaluation evaluation tools

128
00:09:20,730 --> 00:09:24,750
to figure out who our target
target audience may be, who are

129
00:09:24,750 --> 00:09:27,630
we developing this project for?
I'm going to talk about the

130
00:09:27,630 --> 00:09:30,990
project a little bit later on
just in the next slide. But

131
00:09:31,290 --> 00:09:38,070
first we started with using a
fishbone diagram to define our

132
00:09:38,070 --> 00:09:42,540
problem very carefully. So
asking a lot of why's Why do we

133
00:09:42,540 --> 00:09:45,690
see this problem and the problem
that we were seeing when I was

134
00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:51,510
in South Africa, we have said
several groups that are working

135
00:09:51,510 --> 00:09:54,720
in digital humanities and
computational social sciences

136
00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:57,060
but we don't have a community of
practice. We don't have a

137
00:09:57,060 --> 00:10:01,950
community that takes give a
speech stage I will lecture his

138
00:10:01,950 --> 00:10:05,610
knowledge in South Africa in
digital humanities,

139
00:10:05,610 --> 00:10:10,020
computational social sciences.
So that was our problem. And

140
00:10:10,020 --> 00:10:12,930
then we were saying, so what why
do we have like, what do we

141
00:10:12,930 --> 00:10:15,450
keep? If we have a community or
not a community? What are the

142
00:10:15,450 --> 00:10:19,350
benefits of having a community
of practice? And needless to

143
00:10:19,350 --> 00:10:22,950
say, there are so many, many
benefits of having that

144
00:10:22,950 --> 00:10:25,710
community of practice. So it
wasn't hard to decide whether we

145
00:10:25,710 --> 00:10:29,430
should take this project. But
then thinking about using the

146
00:10:29,430 --> 00:10:32,910
fishbone diagram, which I don't
have an image here, but you can

147
00:10:32,910 --> 00:10:37,530
Google for that. And just to
think about, why are we seeing

148
00:10:37,530 --> 00:10:43,200
this problem, and that really
helped us to identify groups of

149
00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:48,300
people who could benefit from
from this project. And then

150
00:10:48,330 --> 00:10:51,570
after developing the the
fishbone diagram, we use the

151
00:10:51,570 --> 00:10:54,450
theory of change, which is also
a really, really good tool,

152
00:10:54,450 --> 00:10:59,220
especially for people who are
developing community projects

153
00:10:59,220 --> 00:11:04,500
where they where you want to see
a change in communities. It's a

154
00:11:04,500 --> 00:11:07,650
really lovely tool to to
consider using in your project.

155
00:11:08,340 --> 00:11:12,990
Because as you are going through
asking these questions, you

156
00:11:12,990 --> 00:11:17,730
really also start to identify
groups of people, which can

157
00:11:17,730 --> 00:11:20,640
inform your personas, because
you're asking questions in a

158
00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:24,300
different way. So just quickly a
theory of change, you take your

159
00:11:24,300 --> 00:11:28,350
project your problem, and figure
out what is the impact that you

160
00:11:28,350 --> 00:11:31,830
would like to see which will
address that problem? And then

161
00:11:31,830 --> 00:11:35,730
you work backwards towards what
are the long term outcomes that

162
00:11:35,730 --> 00:11:39,240
will lead to this impact? to
have those long term outcomes?

163
00:11:39,390 --> 00:11:42,990
What are the short term outcomes
that you should see? And then

164
00:11:43,050 --> 00:11:46,320
what are the outputs that you
will need to see the short term

165
00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:49,860
outcomes? And then what are the
activities that you have to do

166
00:11:49,860 --> 00:11:52,050
to create the outputs that
relate to the short term

167
00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:56,010
outcomes and so forth? And then
really, what do you need as

168
00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:59,580
inputs to be able to do the
activities that will lead to

169
00:11:59,580 --> 00:12:03,540
that efforts were backwards from
the big problem, and the impact

170
00:12:03,540 --> 00:12:08,160
that you want to want to see.
And by doing that, it has helped

171
00:12:08,190 --> 00:12:16,080
us a lot to define groups of
people. And very specific, I can

172
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:21,540
see the personas now, who we are
going to attract in this

173
00:12:21,540 --> 00:12:25,410
project, and supporting this
project, and also who can help

174
00:12:25,410 --> 00:12:30,300
us help us help contribute and
provide leadership in this

175
00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:34,350
project. Another thing that I
want to point to you, for those

176
00:12:34,350 --> 00:12:38,910
of you who are involved in
change projects in community

177
00:12:38,910 --> 00:12:42,150
change projects is just at the
bottom of the slide, the time

178
00:12:42,150 --> 00:12:46,020
that it takes to see certain
changes, just for us to be

179
00:12:46,020 --> 00:12:49,230
realistic. I mean, the OLS
projects are only three months.

180
00:12:49,500 --> 00:12:53,610
And some of some of us expect to
see changes that that really in

181
00:12:53,610 --> 00:12:58,650
communities takes many years to
take place. So just to be

182
00:12:58,740 --> 00:13:06,000
realistic, and a bit more softer
on on yourself when you are not

183
00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:13,860
seeing the change that you would
like to see the theory for the

184
00:13:13,860 --> 00:13:17,910
project called escalator and
it's and one of the one of the

185
00:13:17,940 --> 00:13:21,390
flagstone activities of this
project is to develop a digital

186
00:13:21,390 --> 00:13:25,080
champions initiative. And what
we realized, initially, we

187
00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:27,630
thought we'll just run one
mentorship program very much

188
00:13:27,630 --> 00:13:30,450
like oh, is they'll be or they
will be a mentorship program.

189
00:13:30,450 --> 00:13:34,200
And we're going to open it up to
people doing research in digital

190
00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:36,810
humanities in computational
sciences. And we're going to

191
00:13:36,810 --> 00:13:39,930
teach them digital and
computational skills to do to

192
00:13:39,930 --> 00:13:43,620
use in the research. But as we
work through the theory of

193
00:13:43,620 --> 00:13:47,490
change, and through the through
the fishbone diagram, we

194
00:13:47,490 --> 00:13:52,770
realized, but there are people
who who are not very comfortable

195
00:13:52,770 --> 00:13:57,570
using technology, even in day to
day management of their their

196
00:13:57,570 --> 00:14:02,430
work. expecting someone to learn
to code in Python when they

197
00:14:02,460 --> 00:14:08,310
haven't really used something
like Google Docs or some of the

198
00:14:08,310 --> 00:14:12,750
other tools like that your
Zoom or other tools. Which

199
00:14:12,750 --> 00:14:15,120
means online learning is
probably

200
00:14:15,810 --> 00:14:19,530
a challenge and working alone,
probably not part of many

201
00:14:19,530 --> 00:14:25,140
communities. So we developed a
different type of mentorship

202
00:14:25,140 --> 00:14:30,180
program. And it's also not
necessarily mentorship in the

203
00:14:30,180 --> 00:14:34,800
way that you see here in OLS is
to address very specific needs.

204
00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:38,940
And in this slide, you can see
that we now have six tracks. And

205
00:14:38,940 --> 00:14:42,600
we begin developing content for
those tracks and also partnering

206
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,630
with existing mentorship
programs, to see how we can

207
00:14:45,630 --> 00:14:51,930
build on work that exists. And
here's just another speaking

208
00:14:51,930 --> 00:14:56,460
about pathways again, and I'm
almost finished. And I found

209
00:14:56,460 --> 00:14:59,580
this when I was thinking about
pathways and this whole idea of

210
00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:05,400
them All pathways in not all
participants in our open project

211
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:11,490
goes to leadership. And I found
this this lovely app by

212
00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:15,690
alltrails, which shows all kinds
of different hiking routes in

213
00:15:15,690 --> 00:15:18,480
your area, and then how
difficult it is how long it is,

214
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:23,730
how much innovation the time it
will take to finish it. and

215
00:15:23,730 --> 00:15:27,000
various other folders, I really
liked it, I thought it was quite

216
00:15:27,660 --> 00:15:34,560
a good example of what I mean.
Just to give you some numbers in

217
00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:39,900
a recent study, on open database
service in GitHub, they found

218
00:15:39,900 --> 00:15:43,620
that for the major open source
database projects, more than

219
00:15:43,620 --> 00:15:46,920
19,000 people had contributed to
the project's main repository at

220
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:50,730
least once, which means like,
once in the entire life of the

221
00:15:50,730 --> 00:15:56,430
project, only about 30% of them
have 30% people had contributed

222
00:15:56,460 --> 00:16:01,770
in the last year, which are
called active contributors. And

223
00:16:01,770 --> 00:16:04,650
only about 20% have contributed
more than three commits to a

224
00:16:04,650 --> 00:16:08,820
repo. And you can imagine for
for all of you working on your

225
00:16:08,820 --> 00:16:11,280
projects, how many commits Have
you made your repo and how many

226
00:16:11,370 --> 00:16:15,390
other people have committed, and
just realizing that when people

227
00:16:15,390 --> 00:16:22,890
are coming to your project, they
may only do one, one change. And

228
00:16:23,370 --> 00:16:26,760
that will be used, that will be
useful to your project. And you

229
00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:31,560
should, you know, value them and
make everyone feel that their

230
00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,950
contribution is valuable. And
even if they don't go on to

231
00:16:34,950 --> 00:16:42,810
become very, I just want to show
you this image without which I

232
00:16:42,810 --> 00:16:48,060
found from in the Microsoft,
what is called the Microsoft

233
00:16:48,150 --> 00:16:50,790
inclusive design manual, which I
thought was really, really

234
00:16:50,790 --> 00:16:55,860
lovely. And I do share a link
there on the slide. If you

235
00:16:55,860 --> 00:17:00,900
designed for people who have the
biggest challenges to contribute

236
00:17:00,900 --> 00:17:04,680
or to be part of your project,
you are just reaching so many

237
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:08,910
more people who, as you can see,
for example, if you design for

238
00:17:08,910 --> 00:17:14,970
someone who, who is blind, and
you, you can all also support

239
00:17:14,970 --> 00:17:21,060
people who may have a temporary
problem like a cataract, and

240
00:17:21,060 --> 00:17:23,880
also someone who have a
situational problem like a

241
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:27,600
distracted driver. So it's
really, really, really

242
00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:31,320
beneficial to your projects to
think about the most difficult

243
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:36,000
way, the biggest difficulty that
someone will have to contribute.

244
00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:40,290
And if you follow that, you
really make it easy easier, even

245
00:17:40,290 --> 00:17:47,430
for your most qualified
contributors or participants. So

246
00:17:47,460 --> 00:17:51,690
in summary, as you'll see
online, there are many ways to

247
00:17:51,690 --> 00:17:54,480
develop the personas and
pathways. And I do give a link

248
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,660
just in the next slide to
resources that's provided by OLS

249
00:17:57,660 --> 00:18:01,350
is as well that can make you
think about your personas and

250
00:18:01,350 --> 00:18:05,010
pathways. There's a lot of
information that you can put in

251
00:18:05,010 --> 00:18:07,410
there. And there's a lot of
personas that you can develop

252
00:18:07,410 --> 00:18:12,330
for Be realistic. Remember that
open, open projects often have

253
00:18:12,330 --> 00:18:19,740
limited resources, as long as I
bring for the moment, and that

254
00:18:19,740 --> 00:18:23,340
you would like to be to do more
as the project grows, that

255
00:18:23,370 --> 00:18:28,830
should be okay. And of course,
your inclusivity will grow as

256
00:18:28,830 --> 00:18:33,450
your project diversity grows.
And those just the last quote

257
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:37,200
was basically one value if we
were all forced to pick one,

258
00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:42,030
that designers should have
respect to users time, dignity,

259
00:18:42,030 --> 00:18:46,410
ability and means. And this was
by a Facebook developer

260
00:18:46,410 --> 00:18:52,530
frederico Franchioni. So now,
what Malvika have asked

261
00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:58,410
is that you think about how your
favorite open source projects

262
00:18:58,410 --> 00:19:02,040
have probably use personas and
pathways to attract and retain

263
00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:05,310
you in the project. And then
there's also

264
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:08,970
for this week, you'll have to
develop your personas and

265
00:19:08,970 --> 00:19:12,030
pathways for your project. And
there's a link there and the

266
00:19:12,030 --> 00:19:18,390
links are also in the document
and it does not slide over time.

267
00:19:18,390 --> 00:19:22,110
Sorry. Yes, thank you for your
time.